I thought the belief that something “magically rearranged itself for no reason” is a theistic belief?
I understand the theory of evolution and hence know why it has nothing to do with magic or “no reason”, but if I didn’t I think I would find it easier to believe that random chance would create the world as we know it rather than something even more complex, like a god who can create the world as we know it.
It is an argument/debate with no end…but an interesting and important one.
I think the atheists will never have a reasoned argument for creation and I think believers have a really hard time showing that life is anything more than a bunch of probabilities and that God does not seem to be involved in his creation (Theism? or no God).
I believe in God…but after that…I still want to see His job description.
“Reasons” or “causes” are part of the ways the human mind tries to model the flow of information in the universe. We hope to use this model to predict the future, and often this works quite well.
But it is still only a simplification of something that our minds are much too small to grasp.
In particular, the method doesn’t work for the universe as a whole, if no information is flowing into it from “outside”. If God exists, it doesn’t apply to God, which in principle is an entity without cause or reason.
A second point is that all information transmission or signals involves some random noise. There is always a proportion, however small, of uncaused information in any event.
Damn , you guys are a sorry reflection of what you used to be - metaphysically discussion-wise. But hell, so am I.
Here’s one for you, ya Drima: If I convert and pray like a fundie, 5x a day for years, it’ll leave me a changed man, no doubt. Will it make nit of difference to God, the Almighty?
Is kind of funny, monkeys trying to sum up the universe in a couple of sentences for the benefit of other monkeys. The chaos of reality filtered through a highly specialized pattern recognition algorithm - trying to comprehend things monkeys have no concepts for with an organ meant to recognize things mostly as edible/fuckable/scary.
No, dear primates. Life is not like a banana at all. It’s more like a fish.
“Is kind of funny, monkeys trying to sum up the universe in a couple of sentences for the benefit of other monkeys.”
Yet hard thought and hard work, however inadequate, do provide real benefits for humans. Mathematical tools such as calculus, statistics or information theory give us real intellectual power which is not available to other primates. Engineers and medical researchers can use these tools to build devices which allow people to live longer and more comfortable lives.
The fact that PET scanners or GPS systems do work shows that we actually understand some things, at least for practical purposes.
If you are seeking absolute knowledge, - well, that makes a pleasant hobby for the long winter evenings.
Location: Deep, deep down the orgasmic rabbit hole of epistemology.
The Bio of Awesomeness: Fundamentalist Muslim, turned hippie Sufi and fan of science. Total blogging junkie since 2006. Social entrepreneur and digital media and marketing consultant. Proud Sudanese and cultural nomad. Author of upcoming book on Islam and new media. Pro-democracy guitar-strumming activist. Loud and drop dead gorgeous. Fan of integral theory and spiral dynamics. Sarcastic Afro-Arab goofy genius. The High Priest of Mischief. Welcome. You've Been Warned! ;)
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I thought the belief that something “magically rearranged itself for no reason” is a theistic belief?
I understand the theory of evolution and hence know why it has nothing to do with magic or “no reason”, but if I didn’t I think I would find it easier to believe that random chance would create the world as we know it rather than something even more complex, like a god who can create the world as we know it.
Say What????
None of that has anything to do with atheism. It is just a typical straw-man attack to try and make theism seem more reasonable.
How about this?
Theism
The belief that the only possible explanation for things we don’t understand is a magical being called God
These arguments arise because of the lack of hard evidence.
For example, where are the figures showing the percentages of members of each religion arriving in Hell and in Heaven each week?
Don’t tell me no records are being kept by the authorities in these places. Why are they not published?
Where is Wikileaks when you need them?
It is an argument/debate with no end…but an interesting and important one.
I think the atheists will never have a reasoned argument for creation and I think believers have a really hard time showing that life is anything more than a bunch of probabilities and that God does not seem to be involved in his creation (Theism? or no God).
I believe in God…but after that…I still want to see His job description.
Suppose all this is wrong , is the opposite true ? There is a God who cares if I believe in Him or not ?
Grass needs sunlight but the Sun doesn’t need grass, nor does it care whether or not the blades of grass believe in it.
Nope…the Sun does not need grass…but needs GAS…and that’s gotta come from somewhere…
So round and round we go, eh?
Does everything need to have a reason?
Suzanne…
Yes
“Does everything need to have a reason?”
“Reasons” or “causes” are part of the ways the human mind tries to model the flow of information in the universe. We hope to use this model to predict the future, and often this works quite well.
But it is still only a simplification of something that our minds are much too small to grasp.
In particular, the method doesn’t work for the universe as a whole, if no information is flowing into it from “outside”. If God exists, it doesn’t apply to God, which in principle is an entity without cause or reason.
A second point is that all information transmission or signals involves some random noise. There is always a proportion, however small, of uncaused information in any event.
y’all niggaz are lame.
crack is whack. keep it realz.
Оригинальные задания - командообразование, тимбилдинг.
Damn , you guys are a sorry reflection of what you used to be - metaphysically discussion-wise. But hell, so am I.
Here’s one for you, ya Drima: If I convert and pray like a fundie, 5x a day for years, it’ll leave me a changed man, no doubt. Will it make nit of difference to God, the Almighty?
Did I mention, Don Cox you’re still making some kind of sense
Is kind of funny, monkeys trying to sum up the universe in a couple of sentences for the benefit of other monkeys. The chaos of reality filtered through a highly specialized pattern recognition algorithm - trying to comprehend things monkeys have no concepts for with an organ meant to recognize things mostly as edible/fuckable/scary.
No, dear primates. Life is not like a banana at all. It’s more like a fish.
“Is kind of funny, monkeys trying to sum up the universe in a couple of sentences for the benefit of other monkeys.”
Yet hard thought and hard work, however inadequate, do provide real benefits for humans. Mathematical tools such as calculus, statistics or information theory give us real intellectual power which is not available to other primates. Engineers and medical researchers can use these tools to build devices which allow people to live longer and more comfortable lives.
The fact that PET scanners or GPS systems do work shows that we actually understand some things, at least for practical purposes.
If you are seeking absolute knowledge, - well, that makes a pleasant hobby for the long winter evenings.
Drima, a couple of articles just for you
-
part I:
http://www.theglobalist.com/StoryId.aspx?StoryId=8696
part II:
http://www.theglobalist.com/StoryId.aspx?StoryId=8697
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