The Party: A Sudanese Torture Story

20 Responses to “The Party: A Sudanese Torture Story”

1. The Raccoon on December 26th, 2006 3:05 am

   Interesting. What’s the background on this? Who are these guys and what sort of info did they have that the government needed? Were they actually tortured for information or some other purpose - as a scare tactic, as the voiceover at the beginning seems to implicate? Four months… if this was for info extraction, it is an obvious failure.

   And why’s the main speaker using so many English words?

   Hope it’s not too many questions.

2. Drima on December 26th, 2006 3:35 am

   I was asking myself the same questions too. I tried to research for some background of this documentary and the people in it. Found nothing but it’s still interesting.

3. tsedek on December 26th, 2006 7:18 am

   maybe nice to know that the israeli knesseth is considering legal status to the sudanese refugees (sarcasm mode on here) - to 12 families outta the 280 people….

   it’s a joke

   sorry

   it’s cool-blooded politics again that keeps from the human spirit to act

   ~~~~~Some of the Sudanese refugees appeared at Monday’s Knesset committee meeting, and one directly addressed MK Sara Marom Shalev (Pensioners’), a Holocaust survivor. “I turn to you as someone who fled genocide,” he said. “My relatives were killed before my eyes and you want to deport us to Sudan?” ~~~~~

   http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/805530.html

   GRRRRRR

4. Roman Kalik on December 26th, 2006 8:04 am

   The English part is easily explained, I believe. If you’ll notice both speakers use English words, though the main speaker uses a great deal more of them. I think both knew that the documentary was aimed at an English-speaking crowd, and they did their best to come across in a comprehensible manner while being in a very unstable mental state (retelling such memories often means reliving them in one’s mind, at least in part).

   So they alternated between languages, between trying to speak in English and in their native language, probably without even realizing that they were doing so. And I reckon the folks who filmed this weren’t too inclined to ask them to retell it using a single language, as there’s only so much you can ask of someone who went through Hell and was willing to tell the tale…

   Thanks for posting this, Drima. Though I daresay it ruined my mood for the rest of the day, it was still worth watching.

5. Hipster on December 26th, 2006 8:23 am

   Many Sudanese ppl(esp the older ones) have the tendency to alternate b/w English & Arabic.It was unintentional.

6. Drima on December 26th, 2006 8:52 am

   In my dad’s generation and the generation of that guy who was speaking, English was commonly used since the education was in English. The British were still around back then.

   And Tse, if those Sudanese get deported, they’ll end up getting killed almost certainly

7. The Raccoon on December 26th, 2006 11:51 am

   The Sudanese ‘fugees in Israel ain’t gonna be deported to Sudan, and that’s obvious. If that’d happen, this stinky government is going to have massive demonstrations against it - most of the ‘papers at least report about the Sudanese ‘fugees, and this would be a major scandal.

   So there’s nothing to worry about, I think.

   Thank you for the English/Arabic explanation.

8. Roman Kalik on December 26th, 2006 1:22 pm

   Ah, my bad about the language thing.

   as for the Sudanese refugees… Raccoon, I wouldn’t be all that sure. Remember, the current government doesn’t seem to care all that much for public opinion, and peoples’ lives… pheh. And while I *can* trust some of the people in the government to care enough about peoples’ lives, I fear most are cheap opportunists out for a quick buck, a comfy leather seat and a BMW. And most of said opportunists who aren’t members of Kadima can always build on any public backlash to go against Kadima and not them.

   So… and this doesn’t have me all that joyful… The lives of several hundred people currently lie in the hands of cheapshop political assholes of the Kadima party who need to find the brains to realize that sending said people to their deaths is going to make their political future plunge even further…

   We can but hope that their self-preservation instincts are developed enough.

9. Suzanne on December 28th, 2006 9:10 am

   He’s talking about an organisation which documents torture and other human rights violations. Wouldnt that be SOAT? (Sudan Organisation Against Torture). In the titles afterwards, however, it mentions GATS (Group Against Torture Sudan). Never heard of them before.
   Here is more info on them:
   http://www.afsc.org/midatlantic/projectvoice/gats.htm
   and weblog:
   http://ghosthouses.blogspot.com/

   Anyway, these methods sound very familiar to reports I read and heard of before (concernign ghost houses in Sudan). Therefore, I believe this documentary to be reliable.

   I noticed btw one of the guys talking arabic but saying the words “immediately” and “unfortunately” in English. These words don’t exist in Arabic?

10. Suzanne on December 28th, 2006 9:11 am

    Ah on the ghost houses blogspot it explains who made this film:

    “produced by Survivors of Citibank Ghost House in collaboration with Refugee Club Studio

    * First Screening: Dec. 10th 2006: The Darfur Advocacy Week in Washington, DC

    Speakers: Adeeb Yousif; Adlan Abdelaziz”

11. Drima on December 28th, 2006 1:40 pm

    I know Suzanne thanks for that but I just wish they gave some background to the story… like what information did they want? Why were those specific people arrested and tortured? etc.

12. Suzanne on December 28th, 2006 2:01 pm

    You really want to know (because you dont) or you just would have wanted it to be mentioned in the documentary?

13. Drima on December 29th, 2006 6:26 am

    Heh. Isn’t that the same thing? I wanted it to be mentioned in the documentary coz I don’t know and I’m really curious to know.

14. Suzanne on December 29th, 2006 10:59 am

    It is not necessarily the same thing
    You can also say that you’d like to have that added to the documentary when you believe it is an important item to tell to others who dont know.

    Anyway, it can be because of various things. Of what I mainly heard it is usually not really clear to the victim what they are looking for (they seem to like to ask about others instead of things you did yourself instead), but they just got you there because you are suspected of something or linked to other suspects. Being critical towards the Sudan government in acts or words, is not really appreciated

15. The Raccoon on December 29th, 2006 4:05 pm

    Thing is, this whole story doesn’t sound like info extraction at all. Sudan probably has enough KGB interrogation specialists to do it properly rather than beat people up and rape them with assorted objects.

    If I was a heartless dictator and used such tactics - especially releasing people afterwards - it would have been to terrorize potential opposition. But then again, stuff like this is better done publicly, as Machiavelli suggested. This really makes little sense - either Sudan doesn’t have any sort of info extraction experts, or this was initiated by a sadistic underling for no particular purpose, or this is a sign of socio-political stupidity.

16. Suzanne on December 29th, 2006 4:38 pm

    Raccoon, why would it be better if it would be done in public? People shrug their shoulders when facing horror every day. It’s better to do it somewhere silent; just spreading the (correct) rumors that those ghost houses exist. Much more frightening.

17. The Raccoon on December 31st, 2006 5:20 pm

    Suzanne - because this is not a very effective scare tactic. Gulags, public executions and all that would be more effective. It worked for the Russians… but then again, they also had the infamous KGB dungeons.

18. Suzanne on January 1st, 2007 10:40 am

    If it would have worked for the Russians only a few killings would have been enough. It didn’t work. Nor does the Sudanese way. The best way to avoid troubles in a country is to be an open country, I believe

19. The Raccoon on January 2nd, 2007 6:28 pm

    Suzanne - when I say “worked”, I mean “cowed the populace enough to stop all resistence”. It’s what you want if you’re an evil tyrant. Democracy and liberalism are good for the populace, not for the tyrant

20. mohamed i. elgadi on September 9th, 2007 6:58 pm

    Thanks to human rights defenders, The Raccoon, Drima, Tsedek, Suzanne, Hipster, and Roman Kalik for your comments on this video. I’m saying this and in my mind the shameful level of some comments that posted on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8eDuH1SCQ0

    Im grateful in particular to Suzanne for making the effort and reseraching the validity of this documentary.
    I’m one of those two survivors interviewed in this video.
    A major rationale behind the ‘islamist’ torture system is to crush the body and soul of detainees, but not killing them, then send them back to their community as an example for any one who would dare walking their path.

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