Still Wanna Send UN Troops??!

15 Responses to “Still Wanna Send UN Troops??!”

1. Tsedek on September 30th, 2006 8:04 pm

   Who’s he referring to? The “muslim-nation” in Sudan? Would they listen to him?
   Tse.

2. Drima on September 30th, 2006 9:12 pm

   Tse, all Sudanese Islamist organizations said they will declare Jihad upon any UN troops stepping into Darfur (even if they come in with Bashir’s consent).

   Moreover, they’ve hinted at helping and allying with al-Qaeda during the jihad. They said they will accept help from ->anyone

3. Black River Eagle on October 1st, 2006 3:17 pm

   This is a very good reason why the UN will have big trouble in finding contributors to a UN force for Darfur. Fear of the Jihadists and al-Qaeda and such nonsense. Whether you realize it or not, your country is dangerously close to seeing some serious long-term combat centered not in the Darfur region, but right in your capital city and other major population centers.

   If I were you, I would be very, very concerned about any connection that my government has or claims to have with al-Zawahri & Co. It is time that al-Bashir and his regime in Khartoum start talking some sense and allow UN Resolution 1706 to be fully implemented w/o any problems. It is time that the people of Sudan start thinking about the next government to follow Bashir after his exit from the scene, which in my opinion is inevitable.

   Or would you like to see the Northern Sudan go the way of Somalia?

4. Tsedek on October 1st, 2006 4:14 pm

   Drima, please excuse me if I sound dumb, but I’m getting totally confused by now. Next to tribal leaders (rebels) there also are Islamist organizations fighting Bashir? Or are the WITH Bashir?

   Tse.

5. Drima on October 1st, 2006 5:49 pm

   Black River Eagle,

   I’ve been discussing the same thing on this blog. Sudan is at the edge of a very dark period which I feel is inevitable. “Iraq” has already arrived in Khartoum and I’m afraid even though these are small incidents, they’re set to become worse and more frequent. Things look very very bad. As for Bashir’s replacement -> Anyone BUT Turabi and his Islamists gang. Believe me I would rather have Bashir stay rather than Turabi taking over. For the past 20 to 30 years or so, the man has been nothing but trouble for Sudan and Sudanese politics. He’s the one responsible for establishing terrorism ties and harboring Osama bin Laden. He was one of the main people that made the Bashir coup succeed. He was the one who set the stage of the execution of someone I admire greatly, Ustaz Mahmoud Mohammed Taha the famous Sudanese thinker.

   The best decision Bashir has ever made during his rule is kicking Turabi out and putting him under house arrest. Believe me when I say Turabi is DANGEROUS! He’s been out of house arrest for a while now. In case you didn’t know by the way. Turabi helped incite Darfur’s rebels against Bashir’s government. Sudan’s future now literally rests upon Bashir’s hands.

   Tse, don’t worry you’re not sounding dumb. This IS in fact quite complex.

   Ok it’s like this:

   So far Bashir has opposed UN troops and said the Sudanese military will attack them if they force their way into Darfur.

   Sudanese Islamist organizations said they too will also wage jihad. If there’s no consent from Bashir then their jihad will only be against the UN troops. However if Bashir gives consent and the green light for UN troops to come into Darfur, Sudanese Islamist organizations said they will wage 2 jihads. The first will be against “Zionist” UN troops in Darfur and the second will be within Khartoum itself against Bashir for being a coward, falling under pressure to USA and becoming a puppet to the “Zionists”.

   BTW tribal leaders aren’t the same as rebels. They’re 2 different groups but the rebels do indeed belong to different tribes and have been at war with each other and also against Bashir too.

   Tse, other than me and a few other people out there tracking Sudan’s situation, the misguided majority have no idea how dangerous UN troops will be if sent to Darfur especially without consent. We’ll have another Iraq, in both Darfur and Khartoum. Period!

   This is why I’m really tense. I think Sudan is heading into a dark period. I do hope Bashir rethinks his position and gives consent but I highly doubt it. Even if he does give consent, there will be 2 challenges.

   1- Making sure al-Qaeda doesn’t infiltrate into Khartoum and Darfur.
   2- Controling the damn Sudanese Islamist groups.

   Whatever happens with regards to UN troops, some danger will always exist. However the various dangers will greatly reduce if that damned al Bashir gives his freaking consent to UN troops. I pray he gives an okay… Grrrrrr

   …How about we start a petition to help make Drima go speak before the UN General Assembly or American Congress… Pfffffffff… Sigh! I feel hopeless…

6. Drima on October 1st, 2006 6:09 pm

   BTW… In my humble opinion… All people talking about Darfur from a humanitarian perspective and at the same time keep pushing for military intervention are either insane or misguided.

   Darfur from a political perspective? Military intervention lovely. Let’s bomb the hell out of Bashir and the rebels… Should be fun right?

7. tommy on October 1st, 2006 9:03 pm

   Congrats, Drima.

   As for UN troops in Darfur: the UN should be abolished. So I would have to say, no.

8. Hipster on October 2nd, 2006 10:26 am

   I apologize for being off topic but how is it possible that you admire Mahmoud Mohamed Taha, Allah yirhamo & think that he is a great Sudanese thinker when the bedrock of his principles was unsound?
   Yes, he called for an egalitarian system & a reformed Sharia govt but he misinterpreted many Quranic verses(the Medinian ones) & didn’t accept the Quran as a whole.Kinda reminds of the multitude of non-Muslims who take our verses out of context to falsely prove that our religion is violent.

9. Sudan Watch on October 2nd, 2006 11:17 am

   Drima, good to hear re internship, congrats and good luck!

   Re Al Qaeda in Khartoum. There are many reports in Sudan Watch archives relating to Al Qaeda in Sudan.

   Note the following excerpt from New York Sun article “Al Qaeda Is Entrenched In Sudan, U.N. Envoy Warns” by Benny Avni, Staff Reporter, March 1, 2006 - via Sudan Watch 1 Mar 2006
   http://sudanwatch.blogspot.com/2006/03/egypt-algeria-qatar-object-to-un-peace.html

   According to [top UN envoy in Sudan] Mr Pronk, there is “a lot of talk about Al Qaeda in Khartoum,” where the government is spreading conspiracy theories about foreigners trying to turn Sudan into another Iraq or Afghanistan. Sending NATO there without Security Council approval, the way the Clinton administration did in the Balkans, is a “recipe for disaster,” Mr. Pronk said.

   Citing multiple sources, Mr. Pronk told reporters there is “intelligence information that there are [Al Qaeda] people in Khartoum who have not been there before,” and that those people have issued “threats” and “letters,” warning of retaliation if the Sudanese people believe their country is invaded by the West.

   Khartoum hosted Osama bin Laden in the late ’90s, but the Sudanese government has played both sides by supplying America with some intelligence for the war on terror while continuing to raise the Al Qaeda specter as a warning to the West.

   Mr Pronk said that unlike failed states like Somalia, Sudan’s government has firm control in the country, and that even street demonstrations are orchestrated to the last detail and the crowds “know how far they can go.”

   Currently, he added, the climate against the UN in Khartoum “is heating up,” and therefore it would be “foolish not to take such warnings [of Al Qaeda attacks against a UN force] seriously.”

10. Drima on October 2nd, 2006 1:42 pm

    Hipster, yes the man did have controversial Islamic views and I don’t agree with many of them BUT you overlook alot of other positive things he has done and stood for. Check the link on the left sidebar to get an idea of the great things he advocated. He was a strong defender of democratic values and freedom of speech. He never used or preached violence but instead exercised his rights in the most peacefull means. He did all this during a time when people where increasingly resorting to violence to reach their political goals. I could go on and on about all the noble deeds he did.

    Don’t get caught up in all the negative things that where said about him just because of his religious views. When I say I respect and admire Mahmood Mohammad Taha, think Ghandi… Hindu but nontheless, an amazing and solid character worthy of great admiration.

    Ingrid, thanx alot for your link. I hope the UN is listening well to Jan Pronk…

11. iLaaLi on October 2nd, 2006 2:31 pm

    Drima….
    Gd Luck on the Acceptance… 2 fortune150 companies… you should be proud… just think with your mind, and follow with your heart…
    About the UN.. we shall discuss this in person with a hot cup of mint tea ^-^

12. Tsedek on October 2nd, 2006 3:37 pm

    Drima, I forgot to post this in my previous comment, but of course:

    congratulations with your internship - those companies are really lucky to have you !

    Thanks for your answer. It still remains terribly complicated but yet a little bit clearer now to me anyway.

    So, why do you want Bashir to give the OK for UN troups to enter if you know that Islamic groups are gonna cooperate with and launch a jihad on them and him? It seems to me not having any UN troups at this moment is a hellofa lot less bloody and riskful than with them entering the scene…

    Who is acceptable to the whole of the Sudanese people in representing their cause? The AU? And, if so, couldn’t that force be empowered and supported by “the outside world”?

    Also… what would it take to get the silly ideas of “zionist army forces trying to occupy Sudan” outta their heads? It seems to me that, with thoughts like that, they are playing against themselves, or not?

    (PS - how can you be so clear in the head while fasting? I read your comment this morning -morning in Israel that is- during our yom kipur and while fasting I just couldn’t make any sense of it, leave alone respond in a logical manner)

    Tse.

13. Drima on October 2nd, 2006 4:08 pm

    “So, why do you want Bashir to give the OK for UN troups to enter if you know that Islamic groups are gonna cooperate with and launch a jihad on them and him?”

    I don’t want UN troops to come at all. I prefer AU but if there was no choice left and UN troops were indeed coming, then they might as well get the consent. If Bashir gives an okay then it’s the lesser of 2 evils.

    “Who is acceptable to the whole of the Sudanese people in representing their cause?”

    Don’t really know. All I know is that UN troops will bring trouble and disaster along with them. Many people oppose them but they dont’ mind AU troops.

    “Also… what would it take to get the silly ideas of “zionist army forces trying to occupy Sudan” outta their heads?”

    A hundred years??

    “PS - how can you be so clear in the head while fasting?”

    Hehehe… Ah what can I say ehm ehm… I’m used to it really. It gets pretty easy after the first few days. Just stuff yourself like hell before going to sleep…

14. Hipster on October 3rd, 2006 8:29 am

    “Ghandi… Hindu but nontheless, an amazing and solid character worthy of great admiration. ”

    Of course, I admire anyone who stands up & fights for the truth regardless of his/her religion or race.However, Mahmoud(AR) was a Muslim & he preached some wrong ideologies. It is just like what the radicals are doing now, given the distinct differences b/w the two.It’s all good.
    Thankx for the link:))

    Yea, missed it in my first reply,congrats on the internship.I thought you were going to do it in Sudan:D

15. Black River Eagle on October 3rd, 2006 4:06 pm

    Sorry Drima for taking so long to re-visit this post and check your response(s). Thanks for the link to the Sudan Tribune article but I was already aware of the little altercation between SLM rebels/ex-rebels on the other side of the (Nile) river in Omdurman.

    Don’t confuse what is going on in Iraq with what could happen in Khartoum and across the Sudan. The scenario of an all-out war in the Sudan would playout much differently than what you see going on in Iraq, believe me. But let us continue to play childish games about what could or could not happen if there were outside military intervention in the Sudan and Omar al-Bashir was dumb enough to try and stop it with his various “security forces”.

    Let’s take a look at events going down in Cairo today with the (surprise) visit by U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice to meet with top Egyptian and other Arab government officials. Darfur is at the top of the menue during a very nice buffet dinner tonight. Top European Union officials have finally gotten off their fat butts and travelled to the region to discuss the crisis with the AU and (some) Arab leaders, and the PR of China and Russia have basically been read the Riot Act on Darfur, forcing both countries to slowly slink back into the shadows (darkness) for fear of economic reprisals to their own economies if they continue to support the GoS attacks on its own civilian population. Plus, Russia is gearing-up for all out war against its former Soviet state Georgia, forcing the top EU officials to cut short their visit to Sudan and beat it back to Brussels pronto.

    Does Egypt still receive huge financial backing from the United States for its various development programs and its military? Non?

    That leaves us with the Jihadists and other radicals intent on taking over power in the Sudan. Well, if that were to happen that would give the “international community” another set of serious headaches to deal with in the Horn of Africa along with the failed state of Somalia and the Eritrea-Ethiopia conflicts w/o end, drought and widespread hunger and starvation. Egypt and other Arab and North African neighbors wouldn’t go for this at all due to the instability it would cause in their own countries AND the loss of investment dollars (billions$$$) that they have pumped into the Sudan (via Dubai) over the past few years or so. You see, in the end, it’s all about the money. Their money.

    Turabi? Heard of him but can’t imagine that he would emerge as a key political player in the Sudan after Bashir unless there were some serious financial and military backing for Turabi from let’s say… Iran. Now there’s a wild card scenario for you.

    Whatever happens over the next few weeks and months in the Sudan re: the crisis in Darfur it is bound to be interesting and to have a long term effect on the political landscape of the country. Change is good… when it is change for the better.

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